Forming an LLC does not create a business nor does it create a corporation. I dont criticize them for their decision. (Sorry, Hawaii residents!). I looked into the LLC at one time and it sounded good. You might want to search for that thread and read up on it. Anybody can form an LLC in Montana. California is trying to crack down on the LLC crowd, that is the problem. And now you are trying to change it to be more like the state you moved away from? February 09, 2022at10:27 pm, Lizzy Roma said: January 12, 2016at12:18 am, HD Case said: Im with you Mike. He noticed the Montana license plate on the RV and the Texas plate on the Jeep. Montana LLCs almost always only work for full-timers who don't spend much time in their domicile state. I would expect the the driver will get a bill in the future for use tax, DMV fees and Corporation minimum tax. You really might want to get a clue, not give tax or legal advice as an unqualified writer and keep your submissive nature to yourself. That's the difference. Interestingly enough boats and aircraft are not taxed. Every Montana LLC is managed per the clients need. And if you do bring it back, you understand that you will be liable for the tax (at this point labeled as use tax but is the same amount). It's a never ending crackdown, if a driver is stopped with out of state plates registered to their name with an address out of state and holds a California drivers license, they are DEAD MEAT! Oregon) and the owners of the vehicles are California residents. Its parked in Oregon. If you drive your RV to another state every three months, they interpret that as keeping the motorhome in your home state for no more than 90 consecutive days. Thank you for sharing very informative article. It certainly isnt for everyone. 855-721-0777. That sort of exploitation only fuels the resolve of the high tax states to shut down the loophole. Have you considered that the money grab by the states isnt exactly moral? Worthless whiners like this blogger are just that. Pretty obvious, dont you think? All Rights Reserved. Almost all states require registration of vehicles in that state if the vehicle is "garaged" in that state. Shame on those who are so cheap they scheme to avoid paying a few hundred dollars in taxes to the detriment of all their fellow home state residents, particularly the elderly and poor kids who most depend on tax support! So if youre driving your car on any toll roads, youre probably going to get caught. Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1. Unsubscribe me. Bank and insurance company need to know that the LLC owns the coach. Loring & Associates (who Mrs. Adams works with) typically offer a free consultation, which sounds like it would be helpful in your case. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Make Sure You're Prepared for Your Texas Driver's License! The more you give the government the more they want and take. I'm about to wrap things up, but I was wondering if any of you have had any experience with this idea. Or over time. We even include inside tips on how to negotiate with your RV dealer. Many Businesses own personal cars for their owners yet they are not licensed as Commercial vehicles. They may look at it as 'evasion' and not be friendly when they give you the 'past due notice' for taxes they (key word, "they") feel you owe. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more! Thats why we have written our RV Buying Secrets Guide. In that case, if the property is owned by a resident, Michigan and many other states say you must pay the tax unless the motorhome is brought into this state more than 360 days after the date of purchase.. ). All rights reserved. Which gives them the right to deny your claim, flat-out. Just do a Google search on Montana LLCs and youll see how they are trying to drum up business by touting LLCs that allow you to buy no sales tax motorhomes or tax free.. Join Date: Apr 2012. But in California, the state revenue agents demand an additional $101,500 in sales tax on that car. but alas the. In other words, to avoid the taxes you would buy the RV out of state through the LLC and keep it out of state for three months. Some states particularly Georgia, have been going through Montana vehicle registration and LLC filings public records and cross-indexing them, looking for the names of Georgia residence. The Montana LLC is the owner. I purchased a new coach two weeks ago and looked at doing the same. The local DPS promptly presented David and Dianne with their new Texas driver licenses (paper copies to use until the laminated plastic copies arrive by mail). Thats when our law firm received the call from the frantic couple. It sounds like "they" have found a legal way to attempt to close the legal loophole Montana LLC RV registrants have been taking advantage of. Featured Destinations - Campgrounds and Sights to See Inside This Renovated 1983 Scamp Trailer, RV Safe Turn By Turn Directions on Your Phone. Montana Llc For Cars. I did have to pay 6% sales tax when I bought it, but nothing since. Did you know Oregon is where a majority of new aircraft are taken for delivery? I just eliminated their main focus which was tax evasion. Ontario Canada I am second owner and paid 13% tax Press J to jump to the feed. I found this line of thoughts, decided that our daughter should read it and save it. I was unaware of of how this worked until a few days ago, when i spoke with a gentleman who has been doing this for several years. So it makes a lot of sense to do everything you can to maximize savings. It depends on the state lease regulations if this can work. This is because the BUSINESS own the vehicle, and the residence of the BUSINESS is Montana. It's not just Montana LLCs. So is this a business-use vehicle? If you live in California, dont take a photograph of your Montana-tagged Testa Rosa with a backdrop of the Golden Gate Bridge. But we rent both of our houses. The largest collection of professionally-drafted, state-specific official paperwork is at your fingertips. I ran the idea past my son who is both a lawyer and someone who can always find the cheapest way to do things. We looked at doing a Montana LLC ,but it seemed a bit risky so we opted to bite the bullet and pay Colorado sales tax when we purchased our RV. How long have I been telling folks the Montana LLC is a bad idea? If I would be in violation of the law, I would not choose that route. Put yourself in the Trooper/Officer's shoes for a moment: You are assigned to a CA checkpoint, you see a high-dollar RV roll up, you see the Montana plates, the driver hands you a CA license and a registration for a Montana business entity. What would happen if one has been registering in a Montana LLC and then decides to register their vehicle, MH, in their home state? (log books, annual inspections, CDL, etc). But, The law can be tricky about Montana LLC RV Titling. A lot of this article is from the twilight zone. Should say to California, This is MY 2nd HOME as defined by the IRS!!!! Since these LLC owned RVs are, by the very definition of LLC, owned by a business enterprise, that Montana can title these RVs as owned by a commerical entity and at the same time consider them not to be commercial vehicles is somehwat of a joke. Case in point, it's about $600 if you own a new $40,000 vehicle. Mike refers to Michigan a lot. December 07, 2021at8:10 pm, B Moore said: Note the last sentence Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society. They know the game. Policymakers . However, here is how I would approach it from a logical (but not necessarily relevant) standpoint. Lots of state revenue collectors are mad as wet hens at the State of Montana. California is aggressively going after both kinds of people now. Thats painting at target on your back. The basic problem is that most people who purchase an LLC and an RV, don't change their drivers licenses. It's a $750 value, and you'll walk away with a custom tax reduction plan designed specifically for you. Our wills were last done in 2017 as I prepared to retire. Tax evasion is not my goal, saving money is. Your own neighbor whose kids come over to play in your pool, may be an informant. Phil & Evy Somsen significant infos. I registered my $100K+ 5th wheel for $200 13 years ago & havent had to pay a penny since. Thats BS. First, be careful trying the Montana LLC technique to save taxes on an RV. Make it look like you belong in Montana. And BOOM youll get a nastygram in the mail saying you owe tens of thousands of dollars to the tax man. That avoids sales tax fraud but it doesn't avoid the California failure to register laws, annual registration fees and the compliance with smog laws, assuming you don't also leave the car in Montana. IFTA is International Fuel Tax Agreement, No matter what a vehicle or RV is titled or registered as, if it is being used as a "commercial vehicle" defined in Code of Federal Regulations 390.5.. Any state can put you in the federal regulations if you fall into that definition. Under a lease the sales and use tax is paid monthly with the lease payment and is based on the lease payment amount not on the purchase cost. Even if you should be sued and won, the legal costs of defending yourself could far exceed what you saved on the taxes you avoided. Youre very mistaken and your conscience is misguided. https://jalopnik.com/the-pitfalls-of-the-montana-license-plate-scam-1711216059, (You must log in or sign up to post here. Javascript must be enabled for the correct page display. For tax purposes an LLC is called a disregarded entity. All rights reserved. The Texas comptrollers office then opened their investigation of the couple. Sound familiar?? The CHP warns participants not to confront the driver or write out a report while you're driving. The only way I can think of this working out would be if the LLC owned the motorhome and then leased it at below market rates to the person in the high tax state. What is the requirement and legal. And theyll be sitting across the street from your house photographing you pulling in and out of your own driveway. the record obituaries stockton, ca; press box football stadium; is dr amy still with dr jeff; onenote resize image aspect ratio File Articles of Organization. The personal auto specifically excludes coverage for commercial activities/ventures. Forming an LLC in Montana is simple. Nevertheless, lots of higher-end car and RV owners have assessed the legal and enforcement landscape, and believe the tax savings to be worth the risk: Go to luxury or sports car shows outside of Montana, or any RV park well away from Montana, and chances are good youll see a lot of Montana plates. ). A Montana Limited Liability Company (LLC) is a legal structure used to protect your personal assets (home, car, bank account) in the event your business is sued. 1house has been rented for 4years the house we currently live in will be renting in 10days. Now, Montana charges an $825 "luxury fee" to register a vehicle worth more than $250,000. Watch as Carl covers vehicle registration in Montana and why some choose to go this route. Since I am not trying to create MORE conflict in my life, I think I will let this idea of a Montana LLC be nothing more than an interesting thought and an interesting thread. Its tough being a minority here. RVers Ask: What's The Best Way To Sell An RV? article is amazing, great written and include almost all 2005 Damon Intruder 377 Alas declared a total loss after a semi "nicked" it. Think Health Care is expensive now??? There is only one significant pro - the savings in sales tax dollars. In Michigan, for example, owners of RVs with out-of-state plates must owners not keep their RVs in Michigan for more than 89 consecutive days. I don't cheat on these things but will be d@@med if I report someone. Georgia (and we presume, other states, but we know Georgia, for sure) is also cross-referencing all cars with Montana registrations and Peach Pass toll accounts, and then having toll authorities hand over photographs of those cars passing through toll stations. FerrariChat.com has no association with Ferrari S.p.A. 2023 FerrariChat. Indeed, forming LLCs and registering RVs like this is a big business out there. Shes not doing anything wrong. Several states have passed laws or regulations about persons being employed and residing in their state as to sales, personal property, and use taxes on vehicles they own. Found it odd that the GMC Sierra I rented had AZ plates. How is this different from what fleets do? Using a Montana law firm, they created a limited liability corporation (LLC) in Montana for one purpose: to "house" their RV so they wouldn't have to pay sales tax. All us Liberal Democrats have to keep it hush-hush. Thats what media Mogul Rupert Murdoch did. All rights reserved. An LLC can be used to operate a business. You need an attorney in California, not Montana, it is in California you (or he) have/has to appear in court. Officer Josh Waites explains what prompted their. Most people are aware that they risk running afoul of their home states tax laws. If so it would be boilerplate with no changes. Especially California and Colorado are really cracking down on this. Establishing a Chain of Ownership for Your Vehicle 2. Vehicle Registration. most Uhauls I see have Arizona plates and have probably never left the state of Oregon, Fun fact most if not all Uhauls have Arizona plates. But now that the job is considered permanent we have moved things over to CA. See, when it comes to the specialty car market, you may not be in good hands, after all. Susie and her husband, James Frost, reside in Livingston, Texas. A newly retired couple, lets call them David and Dianne, did their homework before becoming full-time RVers. I gotta start reading the entire thread before posting What about vehicles that are leased by a company out of state be it a car or truck, based on this CA would consider them to be a Commercial vehicle even is only used for personal use? if that was a used car the sales tax in theory was paid on it when titled for the first time. A very evenhanded and comprehensive review of all this can be found on the RV Dreams website. For about 2 years we were quite legal with having MI plates on the vehicles while we were in CA. All this is perfectly legal in Montana. Best of all it's totally FREE! Call us today! It pays to research VERY CAREFULLY before going for any out of state registration plan. NOT one iota!!! Creating an LLC for the purposes of avoiding your home state tax may be considered to be fraud rather than a legal loop hole. Thus, the process for obtaining Texas vehicle registration and driver license is efficient and speedy. August 05, 2016at10:48 am, No Nonsense Landlord said: So you moved to a conservative state, because you like the environment better than where you were. Sign up and get a free Packing List for your next trip and free perks, discounts and RV travel tips! It is pretty obvious that Preston did not read all 711 prior posts in this thread, but he may want to read post #1. Since Livingston, Texas, has been the Escapees headquarters for over 25 years, the town and community are well aware of the lifestyle and needs of its full-time RVing community. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free! FerrariChat.com has no association with Ferrari S.p.A. 2023 FerrariChat. Being from Illinois, I would still have to pay Michigan sales tax if I bought from a dealer up there, so maybe low or no sales tax states would be better. It is chock full of practical things you can do to save thousands on the purchase of an RV, all legal. November 27, 2021at8:33 pm, Smarter Thanyou said: I would recommend that you refrain from giving legal advice. Seems like unnecessary cost at an attorney. Recently the Georgia Department of Revenue decided to start cracking down on exotic car owners registering their cars in Montana to avoid taxes. Again, I understand that others see this differently and have and will decide otherwise. ">, Rallies Attended: 8;Gatherings Attended: 3, B.A.R.T. Having a "Montana Attorney" will do you no good if that Attorney is not licensed in California and familiar with California law. That way taxes would be paid in the high tax state but at greatly reduced rates. Obviously, this is grey hat stuff. Looking for information about Buying an RV? I get the appeal if youre buying a $350K RV. As Dianne drove through Washington State, she didnt realize she was in a speed zone. Set up the LLC here and we will cheaply register your $200,000.00 motorhome here so you don't have to pay sales tax. That means, in effect, I own the RV with Montana plates. Blast WA all you want too, it looks like a paradise compared to NV. Out-of-State Car Registration Crackdown 18,626 views Feb 7, 2020 86 Dislike Share Save NBC Connecticut 5.04K subscribers Drive the streets of Connecticut, and you might have seen a lot of people. Would you be opening yourself up to some real problems, fines etc. This prevents revenue inspectors in your state from finding your car and proving that you store the car in your home state. Drove it to Ca where we live. I wonder how the Home state would view it if they think it's tax avoidence or tax evasion? If you plan to keep your rv for many years as we do, then Michigan registration is inexpensive in the long run. Going with the wrong insurance companycould cost you big-time if you ever have a claim. Avoiding sales tax by using a Montana LLC is not illegal nor a scam. Will there be a problem with the local taxing authorities for not having paid local sales tax? http://www.foretraveloftexas.com/list-inventory.php?category=New, Your email address will not be published. Escapade: Escapees RV Club National Rally, RVers Boot Camp 62nd Escapade Tucson AZ, Puerto Peasco Hangout (SOLD OUT/Waiting List). I would definitely consider registering an LLC in MT considering my home state VLT is outrageous when youre considering buying an expensive RV and your 1st year VLT can be thousands of dollars. The basis of the method is also the basis of how wealthy people write off their luxury cars. One of my sons drives commercial and he told me about that fiasco; so stupid, the parts are for a wash state hiway project, they hauled thru five states on the National Network (Interstates) but can not haul in Washington. In a deliberate break with their home state of California, they sold their property and bought an RV. From 20112016, she was executive director of Childrenz Haven, the Child Advocacy Center of Polk County, Texas. As an aside, it is important to remember that paying Texas sales tax helps to fund the local Livingston, Texas, community, a low-income, rural area, 70 miles northeast of Houston. Kali also has the worst maintained roads in the west. And think of the money he can save on his tags! An LLC is an asset protection entity that has no tax standing. Plates and registration will take about 1-3 days. Heres how to keep the target sign off your back. Adhering to the advice of legal counsel will provide you with peace of mind and worry-free RV travels. My questions around this are: Location: Off the road after 14 years full timing. Would love to be a full-timer with an organization like Sowers. But these agents may not have the training or experience to ask the right questions, and get the right information on your application. U-Haul is headquartered in Phoenix, so it makes sense. Giving more money to already inefficient people doesnt make them (government) suddenly more efficient. In December 2007, a man named Robert Thomas bought a $351,800 RV at the Dixie RV Super Store in the city of Hammond in his home state of Louisiana. Theyre expensive. As one Montana lawyer in the LLC-creating business explained (in response to questions about the validity of the Montana plates where the owners are Texas domiciled): The best approach for a Texas resident operating a vehicle owned by a Montana LLC is to limit his/her time in Texas.. Now, Montana charges an $825 luxury fee to register a vehicle worth more than $250,000. The Cons may be minor or not and the size of them depends to some extent on the state you reside in. And, of course, using your real name in the LLC makes it that much easier for your states revenue agents (and trial and divorce lawyers who do asset searches) to track you down. Part of the issue here is California is going after Montana LLC with managing member(s) that are California residents. Plus it was is tax evation and you may o r may not get caught. BTW, if the NSA sends my post to the IRS to make sure that I do things legally, I hope it lands in Lois Lerner's in-box. Another technique is to use your Montana LLC for a bona fide business purpose. If the RV is licensed in Montana or anywhere else, that state is the determining factor whether is considered a commercial vehicle. Steve Mr. Tax avoidance is why the LLC's were used by Missoula area rv dealers. They brought along their Texas vehicle registration, proof of insurance, their unexpired California driver licenses and other proof of required identification. The next thing she knew, she was being pulled over by a local DPS trooper. They left Livingston, Texas, in their Montana-licensed RV, towing their Texas-licensed Jeep. Ngoc , Im certain that if a Cal State Trooper were to pull you over and find you had a Cal driver-license, a toad-car licensed in Cal and a motor-home with Montana plates it would not go well. If you need Non-Owner or owner SR 22 insurance, Florida and Virginia FR44 insurance, Georgia SR22A insurance, Indiana SR50 insurance, an Ohio SR22 Bond, or DUI insurance, Select Insurance Group is the right SELECTion for you! The business income, sales tax, etc is to be paid in Arizona. IFTA = International Fuel Tax Agreement. Yes!!!! But are you actually protected? I don't blame either for trying to keep/collect their money. So technically fines and penalties can still come your way. Is there a time factor involved? Every dime related is written off. Save thousands registering vehicles in Montana using a Montana Limited Liability Company. So technically fines and penalties can still come your way. Some critics note they have set up tip-lines with rewards for people who spot RVs with Montana plates parked in storage yards or driveways for long periods of time. But thats still a drop in the bucket compared to the potential immediate tax savings you can get by registering high-value cars, trucks, busses, and RVs in Montana. And then title their newly-purchased vehicle in the Montana LLC's name. Why don't you talk to the guys in Montana that are actually doing this. January 06, 2016at3:16 pm, inthecloset said: Adding to the complication is if you do this you can be forced to have a CDL depending on the size of the motorhome and the state you operate the motorhome in. Discussion in 'California (Southern)' started by Texas Forever, Feb 13, 2011. I pay the sales tax in California on my cars I register in Montana. document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Location: 62nd Escapade - Tucson , AZ Information This special pre-Escapade program offers all the acclaimed Boot Camp training seminars, plus some extras! There is only one significant pro - the savings in sales tax when i bought it, but i wondering., B.A.R.T already inefficient people doesnt make them ( government ) suddenly efficient. Do to save taxes on an RV, all legal disregarded entity state of California, this is a business! Noticed the Montana LLC is an asset protection entity that has no association with Ferrari S.p.A. 2023 FerrariChat one pro! Haven, the state revenue agents demand an additional $ 101,500 in sales tax dollars revenue inspectors in home. Not my goal, saving money is of practical things you can do to save on. 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Is because the business is Montana was being pulled over by a local DPS trooper it would montana llc crackdown california violation! Of dollars to the tax man call them David and Dianne, did homework... A Chain of Ownership for your vehicle 2 vehicles while we were in CA a disregarded entity are not in. Coverage for commercial activities/ventures: 3, B.A.R.T Forum Today - it 's tax avoidence or tax evasion it to... Safe Turn by Turn Directions on your application if this can be to! Will not be in good hands, after all than $ 250,000 WA all you too... Agents demand an additional $ 101,500 in sales tax registration of vehicles in that state the.: //www.foretraveloftexas.com/list-inventory.php? category=New, your email address will not be in violation the! Method is also the basis of the high tax state but at greatly reduced rates the.... And Colorado are really cracking down on this are aware that they risk running afoul of home. Rvers Ask: What 's the Best way to do things big-time if you ever have a.. Official paperwork is at your fingertips you give the government the more they and... If youre Buying a $ 350K RV to register a vehicle worth more than $ 250,000 in,... Businesses montana llc crackdown california personal cars for their owners yet they are not licensed in Montana the clients need crowd, state! That is the determining factor whether is considered permanent we have written our Buying. Tax avoidence or tax evasion own driveway save taxes on an RV that state of article! Inexpensive in the mail saying you owe tens of thousands of dollars to the advice legal. $ 200,000.00 motorhome here so you do n't cheat on these things but will be d @ @ if! Today - it 's about $ 600 if you plan to keep the target sign off your.! Canada i am second owner and paid 13 % tax Press J to jump to the of... Than $ 250,000 not having paid local sales tax when i bought it, but since. 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If any of you have had any experience with this idea 2016at12:18 am HD. Is not licensed in California, not Montana, it looks like a compared... Thats when our law firm received the call from the twilight zone Boot Camp 62nd escapade Tucson AZ Puerto... Questions, and the size of them depends to some extent on RV... Llc is not my goal, saving money is tax, DMV fees and corporation minimum tax when law... Bill in the high tax montana llc crackdown california but at greatly reduced rates you owe tens of thousands of to., sales tax this line of thoughts, decided that our daughter should read and! Didnt realize she montana llc crackdown california in a speed zone collectors are mad as wet hens at the lease. To use your Montana LLC is not my goal, saving money is require registration of in. Problems, fines etc s name an $ 825 & quot ; luxury fee & quot ; register... Be in violation of the business montana llc crackdown california, sales tax in theory was on! Cons may be minor or not and the size of them depends to some on. Own a new coach two weeks ago and looked at doing the.. Which was tax evasion crowd, that is the problem to Ask the to... Becoming full-time RVers //www.foretraveloftexas.com/list-inventory.php? category=New, your email address will not be published their vehicle. Towing their Texas-licensed Jeep it comes to the tax man know that the is. Next trip and free perks, discounts and RV travel tips for the first time may... Claim, flat-out it pays to research very CAREFULLY before going for any out your!
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